For the sake of resale value I hope this is a mistake

[TTc8HTC]

How is this a GM thing?

From '20-23 a variety of OEMs raised prices for a variety of reasons largely related to transportation costs and materials.

The Ford Lightning, BMW M cars, you name it, all had price increases throughout '20-23.

If GM can ask more and sell them at that price, why wouldn't they? Meanwhile GM watched dealers marking up these cars and people were still buying.

GREED is the cause.

 

[Jameson's Viggen]

And since the trucks obviously justify the retention of V8s as proven by this BILLION DOLLAR investment, then the ability to continue to share the V8s with Corvette and performance cars disproves the EV BS, and refutes your post that attempted to refute my post stating the obvious:
The 4BW should have had a LTx.

Nope. Not how it works. Disprove the EV BS...GM has made a 27billion plus investment in Ultium. You think it's a conspiracy that I'm making up? That's an huge pledge to invest in capital. GM has also cut headcount in a variety of ways this year to be leaner for EV profitablity in the future. Also readily found in the news.

C8 and any sedan doesn't sell in the numbers the trucks do. The trucks pay the bills. Like I said

The E-Ray is a indication of the future. You think the C9+ is going to use the same small block as trucks still? Asking for a friend, I have no insight into the C9+ programs.

 

[TTc8HTC]

The drivetrain is only part of the development cost, you know that, read what you wrote out loud.

The second an LTx goes in, it has to be validated, tested, crash tested, EPA tested etc. The 4 is largely an ATS which had the LF4 to begin with. The second you put in an engine in the 4 that had previously never been in Alpha2, it's not free. It's added development cost in a tightly funded program. Add to that any adjustments in the rails, firewall, unibody stampings under hood, subframe, any of that to make the LTx fit and you're talking big money.

That makes sense.

But, the Alpha2 and V6TT both had to be validated for the 4BW.
How much more, if anything, do you guess it would have cost to validate a LTx over the V6TT?

 

[565565]

$12k of inflation in less than 2 calendar years?
Did you get a $12k bump in your salary?

Ummm...yeah. Way more actually.

Starting price was actually 83,995 in 2021 so with inflation it should 95.6k. Which means the 2024 model actually costs 1+k less now than before when accounting for inflation.

 

[Jameson's Viggen]

That makes sense.

But, the Alpha2 and V6TT both had to be validated for the 4BW.
How much more, if anything, do you guess it would have cost to validate a LTx over the V6TT?

Correct, still has to have SOME testing on the newer iteration of the platform.

But the fact is the LTx would have cost MORE as it was never in the ATS. More is more. Maybe you'd have the V8 but have to give up validation testing on the 6mt. I for one would never consider a V8 auto. I only got a BlackWing due to the 6mt.

 

[TTc8HTC]

Nope. Not how it works. Disprove the EV BS...GM has made a 27billion plus investment in Ultium. You think it's a conspiracy that I'm making up? That's an huge pledge to invest in capital. GM has also cut headcount in a variety of ways this year to be leaner for EV profitablity in the future. Also readily found in the news.

C8 and any sedan doesn't sell in the numbers the trucks do. The trucks pay the bills. Like I said

The E-Ray is a indication of the future. You think the C9+ is going to use the same small block as trucks still? Asking for a friend, I have no insight into the C9+ programs.

I know that you were correct about the amount of money and personnel GM has thrown at EVs. The writing was on the wall when Al's team was removed from Camaro and sent to EVs in early 2016.

I am saying that EVs and Climate Change are both scams, and GMs investment in EVs is because they are either victims, or co-conspirators in this scam. Either way, big mistake by GM, as smart people will keep their V8s or buy Tesla.

What I know about future products, I am not posting, especially here.
History has proven a lack of gratitude.
Regardless, I do NOT want the extra 300+lbs pounds, and ridiculous $40k premium, for the measly 160hp/125ft lbs that the Eray offers.

 

[raptor5244]

Its Thread of the Year.

To think I started this thread because my local dealer was offering $8k off on 4BWs and now it is up for thread of the year.

 

[Jameson's Viggen]

I know that you were correct about the amount of money and personnel GM has thrown at EVs. The writing was all the wall when Al's team was removed from Camaro and sent to EVs.

I am saying that EVs and Climate Change are both scams, and GMs investment in EVs is because they are either victims, or co-conspirators in this scam. Either way, big mistake by GM, as smart people will keep their V8s or buy Tesla.

What I know about future products, I am not posting, especially here.
History has proven a lack of gratitude.
Regardless, I do NOT want the extra 300+lbs pounds, and ridiculous $40k premium, for the minimal 160hp/125ft lbs the Eray offers.

Al was moved to Hummer because not only was it EV, but the Hummer was a very high performance vehicle. It was a very special program and done far faster than the typical gestation.

Your EV/Climate Change Scam is a thing I don't touch. It spirals into politics, another thing I'm not getting roped into on a CAR forum. It's(EVs/Global warming/politics) often spewed to me by my tin foil hat wearing bro in law. Same guy who spouts 9/11 Conspiracy Theories. Pass.

 

[TTc8HTC]

Correct, still has to have SOME testing on the newer iteration of the platform.

But the fact is the LTx would have cost MORE as it was never in the ATS. More is more. Maybe you'd have the V8 but have to give up validation testing on the 6mt. I for one would never consider a V8 auto. I only got a BlackWing due to the 6mt.

I agree the only way I'm buying a GM product is if it has a clutch.
But, I also require a V8, and the ATS-V should have had one from day one.
We are both obviously guessing on how much more, if any, that would have cost the ATS and CT4 program.
Your position is that it wouldn't have worked.
My position is that it would have worked, and been a much bigger success.
We can both agree to disagree.

 

[TTc8HTC]

Al was moved to Hummer because not only was it EV, but the Hummer was a very high performance vehicle. It was a very special program and done far faster than the typical gestation.

Your EV/Climate Change Scam is a thing I don't touch. It spirals into politics, another thing I'm not getting roped into on a CAR forum. It's(EVs/Global warming/politics) often spewed to me by my tin foil hat wearing bro in law. Same guy who spouts 9/11 Conspiracy Theories. Pass.

It's called common sense.
And, if anyone watches the videos of Building 7 collapsing and doesn't recognize it at the obvious controlled demolition that it was, they have no common sense.

Common sense should not be politicized.



Frankly, I like a brief political discussion as part of larger conversations.
It allows me to judge a persons IQ and ability to think critically, so I can decide how much to value anything else they have to say.

 

[Jameson's Viggen]

I agree the only way I'm buying a GM product is if it has a clutch.
But, I also require a V8, and the ATS-V should have had one from day one.
We are both obviously guessing on how much more, if any, that would have cost the ATS and CT4 program.
Your position is that it wouldn't have worked.
My position is that it would have worked, and been a much bigger success.
We can both agree to disagree.

I promise you, it wouldn't have been free. If you think it would have cost the SAME as the LF4, I can't help you there hehe.

I've had energy meetings called over CENTS in a program when budget is running out. I've had time & a half pulled on programs.

 

[Jameson's Viggen]

It's called common sense.
And, if anyone watches the videos of Building 7 collapsing and doesn't recognize it at the obvious controlled detonation that it was, they have no common sense.

Common sense should not be politicized.

I should introduce you to my brother in law.

 

[Head Hunter]

$12k of inflation in less than 2 calendar years?
Did you get a $12k bump in your salary?

Current US Inflation Rates: 2000-2023

The annual inflation rate for the United States was 4.0% for the 12 months ended May, according to U.S. Labor Department data published on June 13, 2023. This follows a rise of 4.9% in the previous period. The next update on inflation is scheduled for release on July 12 at 8:30 a.m. ET. It will

www.usinflationcalculator.com

We have had 17%+ inflation since 2021 so on a $85k car that’s $15k

 

[TTc8HTC]

I should introduce you to my brother in law.

Sure thing. He obviously has all the brains in your family.

 

[Jameson's Viggen]

Sure thing. He obviously has all the brains in your family.

Not my family lol. I hope you're cool with Christian Radio, prayer at dinner, church twice a week, Bible verses hung on the walls. He's a lot of fun!

 

[dribs15]

Not my family lol. I hope you're cool with Christian Radio, prayer at dinner, church twice a week, Bible verses hung on the walls. He's a lot of fun!

What about the other 5 days?
What a heathen!

 

[BAD2U]

I had a feeling the Blackwings would be dropping in price, but I didn't expect this kind of drop. A Watkins Glen Track Edition for $13k off. $16k off on a leftover 2022. They are all automatics so I am not interested but I could only imagine what they would offer me for my 4BW on trade. Great deals if these are legit.

Link to site if you are in the market.

%VEHICLE_SEARCH_PAGE_KEYWORDS_CAP_FIRST_LETTER% Vehicles for Sale in %CITY%, %STATE% | %DEALER_NAME%

Search %VEHICLE_SEARCH_PAGE_KEYWORDS% vehicles for sale in %CITY%, %STATE% at %DEALER_NAME%. We're your preferred dealership serving %DEALER_GEO_ONE%, %DEALER_GEO_TWO%, and %DEALER_GEO_THREE%.

www.veracadillac.com

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I

 

[Jameson's Viggen]

What about the other 5 days?
What a heathen!

He's reading my nieces and nephews Bible stories every night!

 

[BAD2U]

I

Well I just talked with them and they want the full price. It's a bait-and-switch on my end. SAD.

 

[TTc8HTC]

Not my family lol. I hope you're cool with Christian Radio, prayer at dinner, church twice a week, Bible verses hung on the walls. He's a lot of fun!

That quote right there tells me everything I need to know about you.
The cars you claim in your signature speaks volumes as well.
No wonder GM is circling the toilet.

The V8 GMs I own, and will buy new this year, will probably be my last after being a loyal buyer for decades.