The difference between track and touring mode suspension setting is negligible. The electric/magnetic shock absorbers look amazing on paper but no so great in practice. I spoke to a guy who races his Audi A8. He completely replaced the suspension; he can adjust the height and vary the stiffness to the point where the ride goes from super stiff for racing to marshmallow soft highway. His wife (as passenger) is very pleased. Has anyone done this to their BW? He said it cost between $5,000 and $6,000 as I recall. Any suggestions?
Suspension mod/replacement
- Thread starter jrhammer
- Start date
A Blackwing
Seasoned Member
Which track did you go on where the magnaride was not up to the task?
G.Newt
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- V-Series Cadillac(s)?
- '22 CT4-V Blackwing 6MT
Maybe it's just you. I feel a difference. All the car reviewers feel a difference and praise this gen 4 MagnaRide.
rubberduck
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- 22 CT5V BW Shadow Metallic 6M
I modified the suspension on my S4 with KW V3 coilovers, adjustable sway bars, drop links, transmission crossmember, etc. it was about $5K 12 years ago. The handling vs. stock was impressive. On the medium setting my teeth would chatter driving around town on crappy roads. For track only I think this would’ve been an awesome set up. Looks like the KW V3 is available for Camaro but not Cadillac.
I’m very happy with my Blackwing setup and I can feel the difference between setting.
I’m very happy with my Blackwing setup and I can feel the difference between setting.
Thank you for the responses. To address the above comments:
Ablackwing Track setting is outstanding. Handling is great.
G. Newt, possibly it is just me that does not notice the difference in ride. However, my passengers cannot tell the difference nor can the mechanics at the dealership. They said everything is as it is intended and they agreed there was little or no change between touring and track.
Ribberduck, how was the ride when set to touring?
Ablackwing Track setting is outstanding. Handling is great.
G. Newt, possibly it is just me that does not notice the difference in ride. However, my passengers cannot tell the difference nor can the mechanics at the dealership. They said everything is as it is intended and they agreed there was little or no change between touring and track.
Ribberduck, how was the ride when set to touring?
RKS
Seasoned Member
I ran the KW V3 coilovers on my G37 and they were great but I never got a chance to track the car. I thought the ride wasn't much stiffer than OEM, with much improved body roll but also had a lot of accompanying SPL parts.
BKC1
Seasoned Member
Jr, let me see if I can interpret what you're feeling into a more tangible format. Correct me where I misspeak.
What you probably expected changing modes to do was: 1) increase suspension frequency and 2) reduce body roll, dive, and squat. Dramatically. Those changes are the things we've come to expect with higher rate springs and damper settings; the increased body support is something that all drivers particularly appreciate because controlling body attitude is easier the stiffer the suspension gets.
But with magnetic ride, that's not what happens. The steering gets stiffer, the exhaust gets louder, and there's a weak reduction of body movement--but it feels like the change should be 3-5X greater. Did I get that right?
-----------------
The OEM controller settings on the V-series cars doesn't change things like a stiffer set of springs would. That's partially because it can't; only a fully active system can "push" the wheel down (acting as a variable rate spring) whereas magnetic ride shocks can only change the damper rate.
Even at full current, magnetic ride shocks can only slow down the fluid passing through their orifices; they can't completely stop the flow, so any steady force applied longer than a few seconds (like a continuous high-G turn) will bypass the shock valving and rely completely on the springs and sway bars to counter it.
-----------------
I love magnetic ride and would never replace it with a custom-valved KW Variant 3 like I did on my previous cars, but that doesn't mean it can't be improved. Coming from a KW Variant 3 equipped V, the amount of pitch and roll from the factory is obnoxious, even in track mode. And to me, I didn't initially understand why the engineers didn't dial those things out better.
After digging into this more, the roll/pitch allowance is what enables these cars to perform like they do with skinny tires; weight transfer improves traction. However, when you add power and add rear tire, you might not need or want that amount of squat anymore. Or you might never want that amount of squat; if you're into doing HPDE and never hit the drag strip, there's no point in allowing squat. Same for body roll; once you get some sticky tires and up the power level, the amount of body roll can be excessive.
IMHO, the DSC Sport V4 controller needs to be brought to the ATS-V and CT4-V BW with a proper tune. That controller is faster and can theoretically do a much better job limiting body roll and other undesirable factors, according to reviews. It's also tunable, meaning that you can swap out the OEM springs for higher-rate springs and not have an punishing + underdamped ride. It can also give your Tour mode a more limousine like ride.
I have reached out to DSC Sport to enquire about compatibility with the ATS-V and like I said in other posts, the response you get from DSC is unpredictable depending on who answers the phone. Some of the seem to think that the controller will work on any car. Others think that the CTS-V model won't work on the ATS-V. Some say (and I know for a fact this is true) that development of a custom tune for the ATS-V has to be done by the end user, other say it's automatic. It's a real confusing mess over there at DSC. Therefore, purchasing a DSC Sport kit fell in priority below finishing other parts of my car, but I will eventually get a controller and set to work.
More reading:
www.dscsport.com
I'm currently running Swift springs front and rear at the OEM rate; I developed a kit for the ATS-V, CTS-V, and Blackwings that will allow you to use any standard 2.5" spring on the market. You could use my kit to change the springs to whatever rate you wanted, but I wouldn't stray away from the OEM rates until we have a tunable controller.
What you probably expected changing modes to do was: 1) increase suspension frequency and 2) reduce body roll, dive, and squat. Dramatically. Those changes are the things we've come to expect with higher rate springs and damper settings; the increased body support is something that all drivers particularly appreciate because controlling body attitude is easier the stiffer the suspension gets.
But with magnetic ride, that's not what happens. The steering gets stiffer, the exhaust gets louder, and there's a weak reduction of body movement--but it feels like the change should be 3-5X greater. Did I get that right?
-----------------
The OEM controller settings on the V-series cars doesn't change things like a stiffer set of springs would. That's partially because it can't; only a fully active system can "push" the wheel down (acting as a variable rate spring) whereas magnetic ride shocks can only change the damper rate.
Even at full current, magnetic ride shocks can only slow down the fluid passing through their orifices; they can't completely stop the flow, so any steady force applied longer than a few seconds (like a continuous high-G turn) will bypass the shock valving and rely completely on the springs and sway bars to counter it.
-----------------
I love magnetic ride and would never replace it with a custom-valved KW Variant 3 like I did on my previous cars, but that doesn't mean it can't be improved. Coming from a KW Variant 3 equipped V, the amount of pitch and roll from the factory is obnoxious, even in track mode. And to me, I didn't initially understand why the engineers didn't dial those things out better.
After digging into this more, the roll/pitch allowance is what enables these cars to perform like they do with skinny tires; weight transfer improves traction. However, when you add power and add rear tire, you might not need or want that amount of squat anymore. Or you might never want that amount of squat; if you're into doing HPDE and never hit the drag strip, there's no point in allowing squat. Same for body roll; once you get some sticky tires and up the power level, the amount of body roll can be excessive.
IMHO, the DSC Sport V4 controller needs to be brought to the ATS-V and CT4-V BW with a proper tune. That controller is faster and can theoretically do a much better job limiting body roll and other undesirable factors, according to reviews. It's also tunable, meaning that you can swap out the OEM springs for higher-rate springs and not have an punishing + underdamped ride. It can also give your Tour mode a more limousine like ride.
I have reached out to DSC Sport to enquire about compatibility with the ATS-V and like I said in other posts, the response you get from DSC is unpredictable depending on who answers the phone. Some of the seem to think that the controller will work on any car. Others think that the CTS-V model won't work on the ATS-V. Some say (and I know for a fact this is true) that development of a custom tune for the ATS-V has to be done by the end user, other say it's automatic. It's a real confusing mess over there at DSC. Therefore, purchasing a DSC Sport kit fell in priority below finishing other parts of my car, but I will eventually get a controller and set to work.
More reading:
Support Videos | DSC Sport
www.dscsport.com
I'm currently running Swift springs front and rear at the OEM rate; I developed a kit for the ATS-V, CTS-V, and Blackwings that will allow you to use any standard 2.5" spring on the market. You could use my kit to change the springs to whatever rate you wanted, but I wouldn't stray away from the OEM rates until we have a tunable controller.
Last edited:
sleepys4
Seasoned Member
I was just looking into these controllers! Equally important I wonder if I can find a spring for my car that is a 10-20% stiffer than the swift springs I have.Jr, let me see if I can interpret what you're feeling into a more tangible format. Correct me where I misspeak.
What you probably expected changing modes to do was: 1) increase suspension frequency and 2) reduce body roll, dive, and squat. Dramatically. Those changes are the things we've come to expect with higher rate springs and damper settings; the increased body support is something that all drivers particularly appreciate because controlling body attitude is easier the stiffer the suspension gets.
But with magnetic ride, that's not what happens. The steering gets stiffer, the exhaust gets louder, and there's a weak reduction of body movement--but it feels like the change should be 3-5X greater. Did I get that right?
-----------------
The OEM controller settings on the V-series cars doesn't change things like a stiffer set of springs would. That's partially because it can't; only a fully active system can "push" the wheel down (acting as a variable rate spring) whereas magnetic ride shocks can only change the damper rate.
Even at full current, magnetic ride shocks can only slow down the fluid passing through their orifices; they can't completely stop the flow, so any steady force applied longer than a few seconds (like a continuous high-G turn) will bypass the shock valving and rely completely on the springs and sway bars to counter it.
-----------------
I love magnetic ride and would never replace it with a custom-valved KW Variant 3 like I did on my previous cars, but that doesn't mean it can't be improved. Coming from a KW Variant 3 equipped V, the amount of pitch and roll from the factory is obnoxious, even in track mode. And to me, I didn't initially understand why the engineers didn't dial those things out better.
After digging into this more, the roll/pitch allowance is what enables these cars to perform like they do with skinny tires; weight transfer improves traction. However, when you add power and add rear tire, you might not need or want that amount of squat anymore. Or you might never want that amount of squat; if you're into doing HPDE and never hit the drag strip, there's no point in allowing squat. Same for body roll; once you get some sticky tires and up the power level, the amount of body roll can be excessive.
IMHO, the DSC Sport V4 controller needs to be brought to the ATS-V and CT4-V BW with a proper tune. That controller is faster and can theoretically do a much better job limiting body roll and other undesirable factors, according to reviews. It's also tunable, meaning that you can swap out the OEM springs for higher-rate springs and not have an punishing + underdamped ride. It can also give your Tour mode a more limousine like ride.
I have reached out to DSC Sport to enquire about compatibility with the ATS-V and like I said in other posts, the response you get from DSC is unpredictable depending on who answers the phone. Some of the seem to think that the controller will work on any car. Others think that the CTS-V model won't work on the ATS-V. Some say (and I know for a fact this is true) that development of a custom tune for the ATS-V has to be done by the end user, other say it's automatic. It's a real confusing mess over there at DSC. Therefore, purchasing a DSC Sport kit fell in priority below finishing other parts of my car, but I will eventually get a controller and set to work.
More reading:
Support Videos | DSC Sport
I'm currently running Swift springs front and rear at the OEM rate; I developed a kit for the ATS-V, CTS-V, and Blackwings that will allow you to use any standard 2.5" spring on the market. You could use my kit to change the springs to whatever rate you wanted, but I wouldn't stray away from the OEM rates until we have a tunable controller.
mfbmike
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- Sep 6, 2023
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- 117
- Location
- Central Florida
- V-Series Cadillac(s)?
- 2023 Raven Black CT4-V Blackwing M6
For the first time in probably forever, I am not inclined to touch the suspension on my 4BW yet. It has been superb for daily driving, track time and mountain road driving up in NC/TN.
I've installed aftermarket coilovers, adjustable control arms, etc etc. on previous cars and again, have no desire to mess with whats in there now nor does it seem necessary at this point. Maybe I'm getting old.
I've installed aftermarket coilovers, adjustable control arms, etc etc. on previous cars and again, have no desire to mess with whats in there now nor does it seem necessary at this point. Maybe I'm getting old.
AC2024
Seasoned Member
Totally agree with this. I’ve ruined too many cars lol with my “improvements”. Also, i am floored by the capability in both performance and comfort of the alpha 2 chassis. I am kind of shocked that anyone would think it needs improvement!
vblkwng
Seasoned Member
You can get a handful of 6th Gen Camaro parts for your suspension, and Swift does make Spec-R springs, but I'd leave the magride, it's pretty damn good. It can also be you're turning to early which is moving more weight than needed and not getting enough rotation into the car.
vblkwng
Seasoned Member
The toe links on the 5 BW can be improved...I couldn't get to -1.5 camber without SPL adjustable toe link.
mfbmike
Seasoned Member
- Joined
- Sep 6, 2023
- Messages
- 117
- Location
- Central Florida
- V-Series Cadillac(s)?
- 2023 Raven Black CT4-V Blackwing M6
This.
As good as a lowered car looks, I can only imagine I potentially (negatively) affected the handling of previous cars.
In situations like this where factory hardware doesn't allow for certain alignments, I agree those are necessary.
sleepys4
Seasoned Member
The 6 gen Camaro links just bolt on to the rear? I believe my current street/track alignment is -2.8 front camber -1.6 rear.
vblkwng
Seasoned Member
Yes, the toe link, Camaro Rear Toe Links + Eccentric Lockout SPL RTAEL CAM6
With my CT5-V Blackwing, we were not able to get -1.5 rear without toe being out of wack.
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